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From Serious Eats: New York

Momofuku Ko: Does the Service Matter?

Though not a great one for formality, I do think it is important to be comfortable enough to enjoy your food. I'd love to try the food at Ko, and don't need to be pampered ,hovered over, or draped with fine linen. I don't need a long adjective-laden description of what I'm going to eat, and I'm happy to have whatever's being served. It all sounds like great fun.

But I can't hope to concentrate on/enjoy the food while sitting on a backless stool at a counter, because my back and legs will hurt the whole time. I know there are a lot of people like me in this regard, because I know many of them. personally. I guess it's so difficult to get in that another layer of exclusivity doesn't make a whole lot of difference.

But I think it would be a mistake to imply that any problem folks have with the setup is due to fussy pretentiousness or a need to be coddled. Real chairs are not extravagent- they have them at Bruegger's for heavenssake.

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

For a friendlt, delicious, inexpensive vietnamese meal- try Tram's in bloomfield.

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From Serious Eats: New York

Momofuku Ko: Does the Service Matter?

Though not a great one for formality, I do think it is important to be comfortable enough to enjoy your food. I'd love to try the food at Ko, and don't need to be pampered ,hovered over, or draped with fine linen. I don't need a long adjective-laden description of what I'm going to eat, and I'm happy to have whatever's being served. It all sounds like great fun.

But I can't hope to concentrate on/enjoy the food while sitting on a backless stool at a counter, because my back and legs will hurt the whole time. I know there are a lot of people like me in this regard, because I know many of them. personally. I guess it's so difficult to get in that another layer of exclusivity doesn't make a whole lot of difference.

But I think it would be a mistake to imply that any problem folks have with the setup is due to fussy pretentiousness or a need to be coddled. Real chairs are not extravagent- they have them at Bruegger's for heavenssake.

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

For a friendlt, delicious, inexpensive vietnamese meal- try Tram's in bloomfield.

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

dave and andy's in oakland for delicious ice cream. i hear they've won a few awards, and they've got interesting flavors like cinnamon and pumpkin pie.

pamela's for breakfast -- the pancakes are a bit much by themselves, but get them with some fruit and they're to die for. in the past three years, i've only ever gotten the strawberry hot cakes. if you have less of a sweet tooth, ask for no brown sugar or whipped cream.

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

I moved to pittsburgh 2 years ago and as a vegetarian, haven't always had the most exciting choices when dining out. For the first time in a long time, my own (retched) cooking has been more exciting. I know I can't compare it to New York, but either I need vegetarian suggestions or the city has an need and opening for this corner of the market.

Anyway some friends dragged me out this week to a bar/lounge called the Firehouse for a cocktail and appetizers and I was very excited by my options on the menu. I wasn't stuck with grilled cheese, a salad, or a veggie patty. The menu was tapas style, but I would have to say some of the best food in the city ( and a beautiful, extensive wine list to boot).

From Serious Eats: New York

Momofuku Ko: Does the Service Matter?

A great article, and obviously a restaurant with great food and talented chefs.

-----------------
"When I was thinking about Ko, I didn't think much about the service."
-----------------

But from an outsider (me), seeing this quote from the chef/owner is a bit troubling. And then to see him explain that he doesn't want good service to interfere with the "core values" makes it sound even worse. After all -- shouldn't good quality service be included as part of the "core values" ??

I get his point about the food. It's all about the food.

But shouldn't good service be a basic, fundamental element of most any long-term successful business, whether it's a fine restaurant or a muffler shop?

From Serious Eats: New York

Momofuku Ko: Does the Service Matter?

I had great service there at Ko, but i cannot compare it to four star restaurants because I've never been to one. Maybe some people expect too much? Some may have this idea that "I am paying for service!"

No, I am sorry. You are paying for a product, or the right to try a product. It just so happens that expensive restaurants care about service because they know they are expensive and want patrons to come back. The price is tied to demand and rent rates, not to how well they feel customer services is, and what ppl would put up with.

Experience is so tightly tied to expectations, and I had high expectations of the food, and it was such an enjoyable experience. Maybe I did not go in expecting to be pampered, and that helped.

From Serious Eats: New York

Momofuku Ko: Does the Service Matter?

I think I lucked out by having David Chang there when i went, but it was very friendly service. David was cracking jokes with us and when I asked him how they made some dishes he was happy to get into a discussion. At one point we had two other diners involved in a conversation and David was telling us a story, from the other end of the kitchen one of his sous chefs stated "good story Dave" and the place busted out in laughter for a few minutes. I acknowledge this was unique and not the norm, but it certainly was a very relaxed, casual atmosphere with the highest caliber of food - which in a sense was a mind trick of some sort and makes it so unique. Other experiences I've had at a dining counter range from TKC @ Beacon to Degustation or even just a sushi bar, but this was different than all of them (closest to Degustation, but better food). I'll save up for another meal later in the year, but I fully know my experience with the service may be better or worse. Kudos to the Ko staff for a 3 star review.

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

@susquehanna, regarding Bourdain:

Yes, I was really frustrated too. I guess that it was to be expected, with a young crowd of line cooks. Though I probably wouldn't mind having a beer with Tony, that is for sure! I think that he was probably slightly amused but I'm sure he thought it was a little obnoxious and was being gracious. I also, was a little too shy - the girl next to me asked a question. Although, after I got home, I thought of the perfect question: "Was the photo shoot in My Last Supper your idea?" :)

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

Thanks for the recommendations, I hope we can find some of them.

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

@Susquehanna:

My husband and I were at the Bourdain lecture last night too. I was also seated in the second balcony, right in front of a group of restaurant folk who were so rowdy they made it hard to hear his responses during the Q&A. I think anyone who has read his books or watched NR fairly often has heard what he had to say before, though he certainly has his schtick down pat! We did enjoy the lecture despite the lame Q&A.

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

please, for the love of all that is holy, visit Uncle Sam's Subshop in Oakland (near Pitt campus). I lived in Pittsburgh for 5 years, and now live in Philly, and I have to say Uncle Sam's steak and their fries kick Philly's "authentic" variety to the curb.

Spice Island is also in Oakland, and has pretty good Burmese/Thai/Chinese food. Tip: skip the noodles and get a curry or the 5 spice chicken, very very good and you won't pay more than $10 for a big meal. Also extensive tea menu.

Southside (Carson St) is great, lots of energy and interesting people, and amazing restaurants. Perfect place for a night on the town.

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

@Littlebluesiren: I was at Bourdain's lecture. Up in the second balcony. Weren't you frustrated with the audience's lame questions? Nobody asked about projects he may be developing, Top Chef, his best frenemy Ruhlman, or what it's like being a new dad. Shyness kept me from the Q & A mike. Wish I wasn't that way.

Anyway, the Pgh line cook contingent was out in full force! Can you believe how they were begging the man to go out for drinks with them or to "come back to my restaurant"? Do you think he was genuinely amused with this -- 'cause he was laughing pretty hard -- or was he just smitten with how pathetic the quality of the Q & A had become? Maybe it's a common thing at his public appearances.

@anybody: Did anybody else go to Bourdain's Drue Heinz lecture?

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

I used to live in Pittsburgh in my 5 years at CMU and I just have to toss in my 2 cents about some of the places already mentioned:

1) Church Brew Works: Take the trip. Beautiful atmosphere, some very good food (I really enjoyed their venison meatloaf the one time I went), and some excellent beer as well. For me that's really something because I really don't like most beers!

2) Chaya: I went there numerous times with my friends when we decided that Friday night meant emptying our wallets and eating big. While you may have to wait for seating at dinner hours (usually crowded) it's worth it. Absolutely magnificent food, spot-on every time. The sushi boats are quite a sight to behold and are quite fresh.

3) Lulu's: Yup, a fine place for the collegiate crowd to go for some good Pan-Asian eats. Very reasonable prices, some excellent takes on old classics. I still miss their wonton soup quite a bit, mostly because it involved bonito broth instead as well as many other veggies and ingredients I usually don't expect. Quite flavorful!

Great, now I miss the ol' place. Guess I'll have to go back eventually to catch up with friends and food!

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

I can't believe how late I'm coming to this post, but I also live in Pittsburgh and can't say enough about the food scene. Everyone has really wonderful suggestions, so I'm only going to add two places that I dont' think were mentioned:

Udipi Cafe in Monroeville - South Indian diner, amazing dosas and uthappam
Legume Bistro in Regent Square - french/italian country cooking, with a commitment to the local and seasonal

The Strip, as mentioned, is the mecca of food in the city.

I just came back from the Bourdain lecture and I am so happy to read this post and see all the connections to Pittsburgh on SE. Now I want to go and have a meal with you all!

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

Primanti's is awful so don't bother.
Must visit Pamela's for breakfast.
Tissaro's for burgers.
Fiori's for New York style pizza. It's the best by far.
Mineo's for sicilian style pizza.
Sesame Inn for Chinese.

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

I am so glad this thread is new!

My DH and I are going to a convention in Downtown Pgh in two weeks. We will NOT have a car, and need recommendations for eateries reachable by foot or inexpensively. We are staying at the Commonwealth Hilton and the maps look pretty bleak.

We would rather not eat at the hotel the whole time, and would love some local flavor!

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

@OrigCyn: Food writers seem to be turning an eye to the culinary underdogworld already. For example, Andrew Knowleton - you may recall him from TVFN's "Next Iron Chef" - wrote a _Bon_Appetit _ article a few months ago called "Humble is Hot," where he profiled exceptional restaurants in small towns. If it isn't already, Knowlton's profiling article should be a permanant part of B/A's monthly magazine. It encourages small town chefs to improve and innovate when they're getting big-time kudos like that.

Just curious, but why wouldn't it be a good thing to have Pittsburgh profiled?

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

Pittsburgh, part 2

Over around Greentree-Crafton, go to Angkor. It's in a small strip mall area (2350 Noblestown Rd), and dthe same folks who own the Lemongrass downtown own it. The food is primarily Cambodian-Thai, with a few Chinese dishes added. We have never had anything bad there. My favorite is Lock Lack, beef tenderloin pieces marinaded and cooked, served with lemon pepper sauce. oh, and don't forget to try their version of fried ice cream

Moroeville - go to TaiPei Tokyo. Wonderful sushi and sashimi, and you can choose Japanese or Chinese dishes. The whole fish in black bean sauce is all there is to one dish, but each bite gets better and better...Again, everything we have had so far there is better than the last. Bento box lunches are fun also...salad, soup, California rolls, and tempura veggies - nice, healthy and delicious.

LuLu's Noodles, in Oakland, near Pitt University - yes~~~a must go place.

Also in Oakland, (if it's still there), The O for chili hot dogs, fries and onion rings...

Back to Oakmont, choose between Hoffstot's, or the Chelsea Grill. I prefer the old fashioned, elegant Hoffstot's, even when I get a dark beer and fish sandwich. But if you are going for dinner, their scallops or shrimp in the orange and lemon butter sauce are well worth it. My first choice is usually one of their specials OR a dish I have never seen or had elsewhere - Veal Miceli - created by a former chef there. slices of veal, coated with crumbs and fried, wrapped up in deep fried eggplant slices...cheese, sauce...5 **** or better. BTW...sometimes, if you are lucky you will get to see current or past Steelers there.

Desserts, except for Italian cheese cake and their own version of deep fried ice cream with either amaretto fudge sauce, or cherry pie filling or fresh strawberries, the other desserts are not made on site. So before you leave, and if the Oakmont Bakery (in between the 2 restaurants) is still open, check out their Oakmonter or Almond tort (buy a large one, or small 2 person one), or one of their exquisite designer cupcakes. My son and his new bride had the cupcakes at the wedding instead of a wedding cake.

There are folks who don't live here think we still have steel mills blasting away, or that we are all newcomers to the country...but we have tremendous food in Pittsburgfh, inc. the South Siide which now has several new restaurants (try a corned beef sandwich with your Guiness at the Cladagh...)

There are little known places like Jimmy's (brand new) Thai food in Verona...

Darn...I am now so hungry

Yes! Pittsburgh is more than halupki or haluski (both of which I cook at home ... I think we are waiting for Gourmet or Bon Appetit to discover us! But maybe that wouldn't be a good thing.

Hugs from OrigCyn

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

After reading the previous sharings, I thought I'd add my 2 cents to the discussion. I live about 15 minutes from dahntahn, in Oakmont. There are so many great places to eat in Pittsburgh. I have to admit though, that I do NOT like Yuengling beer, but give me a Rolling Rock especially with a great big fish sandwich, and I am a happy "yunzer".

I think the person who wrote about the Brew Church might have meant the Church Brew House in Lawrenceville. You have got to try their pierogies - they make new kinds all the time, including a black bean with salsa, etc.

I side with the person who did not like Buca di Beppo - my hubby and I have been there twioce, and both meals were horrible. I do not eat salad that has brown or plain out dead lettuce in it. Chicken should not be dry. It's sad that a pasta sauce tastes burnt...'nuff said.

I love Monteray Bay up on Mt. Washington. Their grilled scallops or the crabcakes - TDF. Yes, it's pricey, but sure worth it when it's your anniversary (and they gave us a free dessert for the occasion.) Howver, their other restaurant in Monroeville cannot compare. I had lunch with 2 friends there. The only thing that all 3 of us ate that was the same, was the sweet pea pods. We all got sick that night.

If you are going to the Strip, do go to Klaven's old fashioned ice cream parlor. Wonderful treats, atmosphere...they even make their own flavored whipped creams. The banana split is decadent. forget your calories and enjoy!!! Oh, and it's on Penn, I believe, but a few blocks away going towards Lawrenceville and beyond.

L a Prima coffee? My first visit there some yrs ago, I had no clue as to what all the sizes were etc. The staff treated me as though I were totally stupid, one woman said every word of her explanation very slkowly,as though I were deaf and dumb. And now, their coffee is being used at the former Oakmont Coffee Company on Allegheny Boulevard in Oakmont. Do not care for their coffee at all - it's just like Eat & Park's - always tastes s though it's been burned.

BUT if you want fantastic coffee, where the beans are roasted fresh, go to one of the Coffee Tree Roasters in Fox Chapel, Squirrel Hill, or - argh - can't remember where in South Hills...the Sumatra blue linton, the peaody...their estate Kona (they buy the entire crop that one Hawaii coffee plantation grows. And they roast their own!!! If you go to Squirrel Hill, and Jon is working? Ask him for a cup of black cat. It's his mixture, and you will want to buiy a couple pounds to take home for yourself.

Some more suggestions in next post...

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

CC's Cafe and The Gran Canal in Sharpsburg are two of the best Italian restaurants in Pittsburgh. Also, Lunardi's in Beechview is excellent Italian food. For locally sourced food, try Iovino's in Mt. Lebanon.

I'm probably the only Pittsburgher who doesn't like Pamela's. It's really greasy and their home fries are odd. I haven't been impressed by bonna terra (also in sharpsburg and previously mentioned).

For lunch, try Colangelo's in the Strip (Tuesday is spinach pasta day). It's right by La Prima Espresso - some of the best coffee in the city.

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

I'm surprised no one has mentioned the Grand Concourse in the Station Square area over the Smithfield St. Bridge. I believe the building is an old railroad house. It's a steak and seafood place with a very extensive yet expensive menu. I went there with my girlfriend for our one-year anniversary last summer on a vacation to Pittsburgh, and they even printed a 'Congratulations' to us at the top of our menus, which we got to keep. I remember the food gave us multiple yumgasms.

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

@Susquehanna - as much as my friend prides him self on some culinary adventurousness, he does tend to dine frequently at the same places. His comfort zone is Italian so I'm excited to see all the other prospects for him to try. If I ever get to Pittsburgh to see him, I'll enjoy all these discoveries as well!

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

@StripeyChef: The Andy Warhol Museum still has Good Fridays, including a cash bar from 5 - 10 pm and half price admission. On the second Friday of every month, I believe, The Warhol Cafe & Big Burrito Group have a wine-tasting and snacks.

Last time I was in the The Warhol Cafe, I saw John Waters having lunch with some museum board members. Exciting!

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

I live and work in the Squirrel Hill neighborhood of Pittsburgh and don't often move beyond a 3 mile radius for dinner. Fortunately there are dozens of good, cheap to moderately priced restaurants in my little slice of the world. Here are a few that haven't been mentioned: For nice Italian food La Cucina Flegrea is usually quite good. The Noodle Hut in Regent Square is cheap, and addictive. Likewise for Rose Tea Cafe, if you enjoy Taiwanese food. I think Sun Panang is pretty good too. People's India in Garfield is cheap and tasty, you guessed it, Indian food. Have you noticed cheap is a big thing with me? There's a Pamela's in Squirrel Hill too - for breakfast all day. Bona Terra in Sharpsburg has already been mentioned and is not cheap, and is more than 3 miles from my house, but I like it enough to highlight it again anyhow.

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

Don't miss breakfast at Pamela's in the Strip district. (they don't take credit cards though, so be prepared). Also...great Thai food at a little hole in the wall called Sweet Basil--2 locations--one on Murray Ave in Squirrel Hill and also one in Lawrenceville-both are BYOB as well...another up and coming neighborhood in the Burgh.

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

Hell, we've recently driven ~3 hours (includes getting lost) to go to Pittsburgh to eat at Sonic and visit IKEA.

True story.

We don't have a closer Sonic or IKEA. :)

From Talk

Yeah. Pittsburgh.

@chiff: I moved to Pittsburgh two years ago. I don't know how long your friend has been here, but I submitted this question to broaden my horizons. There is more culinary depth here than I ever imagined.

And Bourdain will be in town next week for his Drue Heinz lecture. I couldn't help but wonder what both culinary professionals and amateurs think of our city.

Living in the Philly area for three years lead me to include that "gentleness" caveat, as some Philly and Cleaveland folks ferociously cut-up the 'burgh. Luckily, those contingents on S/E seem most benevloent.

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