Serious Eats - seriouseats.com

@ CookiePie I love cucumbers like that. It is one of the only ways I eat them.

About kids at restaurants... I think it depends on the parents. Leave your kids at home until you are willing/able to properly train/discipline them to eat at the table. Growing up I always ate dinner with my family, whether it was at home or out; however, the same rules always applied: no elbows on the table, not chewing with your mouth open, NO SINGING, no throwing foods or making potions in your drink, etc etc. My mom brought a coloring book and some crayons and I was happy as a clam. So... I definitely think it depends on the parents. Also, it is very difficult to compare manners in Europe (Spain) to those in the U.S.. In Europe they eat with their fork and knife throughout the whole meal, no switching the fork after cutting. My mom will have none of that while we're in the U.S.. I think things like that and hands/elbows on the table depend where you are.

@chiff0nade I completely agree. Unless one's food is hot and other people prompt them to start with a "please go ahead, you're food will get cold," it is considered impolite to start eating before everyone has been served.

@Cary I completely agree. I would say at nicer restaurants woman should definitely be promted by the waiter to order first. Sometimes I am not ready yet so I will tell my boyfriend to go ahead, but yes, typically I would say the woman should go first and also in descending orders. I do; however, feel like this is more of the waiter's responsibility than your husband's, so if the waiter looks at him to order before you... go with it.

I'm serious you should definitely get these baguettes. They're life changing.

In restaurants I eat American style, though I occasionally switch back to the European style I used for that year I lived in France without realizing it. In Europe I definitely only use European style. In Asian restaurants that use chopsticks, I use chopsticks.
AND in Filipino restaurants or at home I often use a spoon in the right hand, fork in the left. Yes, this is the aforementioned shovel style. And it's the absolute best way to pick up rice, meat, and sauce all in one bite. If people haven't seen it before, it freaks them out.
I have one nephew who prefers to eat with his hands (the way his grandmother eats at home) and it's just fine by his parents as long as he doesn't do it at school where everyone assumes it's bad manners.
Nothing wrong with learning all styles, it helps you understand a culture. For instance, French people are freaked out by American style because you put your hand in your lap while you're eating, and it makes them wonder what you're doing with that hand! European style always keeps both hands on the table.

I'm British and I eat appropriately (also having strict parents who were insistent on this). I hold my folk in my left and hand and knife with the right hand, I do not 'shovel' food. Sometimes I go for dinner at friends houses and have to ask for a knife so I can eat my food. I often receive complements on how well I eat.

I have NO IDEA why, but I've always eaten European style, or rather, backwards American style. I'm a rightie who cuts with her right and eats with her left. BUT if there's nothing to cut, I generally eat rightie...

> In reading back through this thread, i realize I may have come off a little
> bit like Miss Manners. I was answering mainly as a former server (who
> loved the job)... Manners boils down to making everyone comfortable
> around you....most often, sticking to etiquette makes people
> UNcomfortable in casual situations so I agree, do what works.

As it happens, I have met and talked with Ms. Martin a number of times. Making people comfortable is in fact what manners - etiquette - is about. The "rules" make sure that everyone is operating under the same set of expectations.

Manners are not for special occasions. They are most important with the people who are most important to you, including on casual occasions.

> If someone's plate arrives late and the person says, "please start before
> your food gets cold," is it then appropriate to start, or should you still wait?

Wait. "Thank you, I'll wait for yours."

Whether at home or out, eating begins when the hostess picks up her fork. If all men are dining, or a woman is not playing the role of hostess, the host indicates beginning to eat.

It is the responsibility of a restaurant to serve everyone at table together, regardless of differences in preparation time. The expectation is that service happens at the same time, not start-of-cooking. Therein lies a core difference between a cook and a chef.

As for GolfGirl's difficult family members, gentle off-line introduction to etiquette, perhaps with references to Amy Vanderbilt or Emily Post might help. If they aren't sufficiently open-minded, then part of good manners is avoiding a scene in which case please eat to avoid the tears and certainly to avoid people popping up and down like Jacks-in-the-box to microwave things.

regards, dave