Taste
That Sandra Lee post got me thinking. With all the pre-made made stuff, has a generation or two developed a McPalate where sweet and salty rule? Do the majority not know how seasonal fruits and vegetables taste? What would have to happen to get back to basics?
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16 Comments:
Sadly, new generations aren't the only ones suffering from a "Mcpalate." I notice it with my parents. I cook for them often and neither of them seem to be able to get into organic produce from the farmer's market. I know that I season my food well, but still they swear "it's not salty enough," and so they load on extra salt.
It bums me out. I actually think kids have a better chance of getting back to the basics than adults do. Well, if their parents make the effort. I'm not a parent, but I have two small nieces that I'm very close to. They've made me realize that a lot of a kid's feelings about food come directly from their parents. My nieces will eat anything- and I mean ANYTHING at least once and I know that's because both of their parents are open to different cuisines, different tastes, and make an effort to pump them full of healthy stuff and vegetables. That, on top of the fact that I've cooked organically for them all of their life, taken them to farmer's markets, taken them to various ethnic restaurants, etc., etc.
My nieces are friends with these two little girls who are really picky eaters. I used to try to cook dinner for all of them, but quickly became so annoyed with their two little friends who wouldn't eat asparagus, who wouldn't eat a fresh tomato, who wouldn't eat mushrooms. I couldn't figure it out, they simply wouldn't eat vegetables despite not knowing what they tasted like and having never tried them before. Then, their mother came over for dinner one night and she, in front of her children, made a big fuss about how she wouldn't eat asparagus, wouldn't eat tomatoes, wouldn't eat mushrooms ... She HATED vegetables and refused to try things she'd never even eaten before.
I think a lot of it depends on the parents and unfortunately, they are blissfully unaware (for the most part) of just how bad pre-made items and fast food is. It's literally loaded with junk and chemicals and I think if they really knew how bad it was, they wouldn't feed it to their children.
PumpkinBear at 4:31PM on 02/02/09
My daughter who became an Mickey D-ite as soon as she got her own wheels is baaaack. What happened? She's pregnant and feeling queasy. "Mom, I've haven't been eating anything except fruit, salad and yogurt."
Some of it is not being able to keep greasy foods down. I hope some of it is thinking about her baby.
Blue Iris at 4:33PM on 02/02/09
Humans are designed to want sweet and salty, but a lot of things that are high in sodium don't taste all that salty, and things with HFCS don't always seem sweet, which is unfortunate.
And honestly, a lot of people have the attitude that more is better. Bigger portions, more heat, more salt, more fat, more sugar, more everything. I'm all for using herbs and spices, and I love hot peppers, but I also love the taste of a really good unadorned piece of meat or a plain vegetable.
How often do we see someone bragging that they make the best mashed potatoes, and that claim is based on the use of extra ingredients because plain mashed potatoes are too bland? Spicing up a dish is nice, but I see nothing wrong in enjoying the taste of a plain potato. Not everything has to be slathered in bacon grease, habanero peppers and garlic. There's a difference between seasoning a dish and obliterating it.
dbcurrie at 6:59PM on 02/02/09
@dbcurrie... you're full of crap! Of course everything has to be slathered in bacon grease! LIAR! ; ) But I digress, people are getting further and further away from where their food comes from. They have been told since the late 1940's how good, time saving and nutritious canned vegetables and processed foods are because food science says so.
I was speaking with an animal sciences professor at Auburn University (WAR EAGLE) who said a majority of kids coming into the animal sciences programs now have either never been to or even seen a farm and he feels as though it has affected the way people feel about food. Go into a supermarket and see the nicely styrofoam portions of pretty meat... most folks have forgotten that these things come from actual animals! And why shouldn't they be entitled to a nice red tomato in February?!
It boils down to education, we need to be teaching some form of basic nutrition from an early age in our school systems ( and I'm not talking about the four food groups (I may have just dated myself!) or the new pyramid thingy. I am talking about where our food comes from how and maybe when it is grown. I know, the teachers are already mandated to teach an impossibly vast amount of information in an impossibly little amount of time. But that's where it has to start.
My son is one who has a McPalate I'm sad to say. When he was little and My ex and I were still married... That boy would have eaten a crap sandwich if I told him it tasted good. Now he eats about 3-4 meats and all of them with ketchup (ham, porkchops, chicken, and of course hamburgers) he eats maybe 4 kinds of vegetables.... 4 kinds of vegetables?! WTF?! Let's not get into why he does this, but I can tell you it has something to do with his surroundings. I asked him if he wanted to go for chinese food and he said yes... this got me excited until I saw him order a poo-poo platter and asked for ketchup! So much for an intro into Asian cuisine.
I'm afraid it's too late for most parents to forget these learned behaviors. I was thinking about this last night when I saw that HFCS commercial where the girl was eating a popsicle and the guy said "isn't that bad?" the girl said "Why?" and they both looked dumbfounded and asked for more. I was thinking about a series of commercials going the other way funded by anyone from the American Heart Association to the Organic Farmers Association. It could go something like this...
Shopper looking into a frozen food case... Man from inside the case opens the door and leans on a counter like at a deli. He has a thick gruff NY or Philly accent and says.... "what'll ya have?"
Shopper: "I was looking for a nice frozen dinner for my family"
Case man: "Lasagna sound good?"
Shopper: "Yes, sounds nutritious!"
Case man: (shouting) "ONE LASAGNA!" (commotion in the case)
Case man: (turns with tray of stuff) "Here ya go"
(case man then pours into the lady's open hands in clearly marked containers... salt, HFCS, MSG, corn starch, sugar, stabilizers, preservatives, dehydrated this or that, blah, blah, blah, etc...)
Case Man: "Enjoy! and don't forget ... antacid in aisle 4" (slams case door in her face with the ingerdients all over the floor)
Voice Over Announcer: "If you wouldn't eat these ingredients by themselves, why would you make your family eat them?" "Eat health.... eat smart!"
You get the picture... Start showing people what they are stuffing their faces with. Some are too think to get it, but maybe, just maybe.... in their laughter....it will plant a little seed. But hopefully the seed is something that will be "in season"
Sorry for the rant.... Great Topic BTW!
Pavlov at 6:25AM on 02/03/09
@Pavlov--the fact that most kids coming into universities know little about how food comes to the table didn't surprise me--but that even the kids in the ANIMAL SCIENCE major didn't know much is truly shocking!
I work with teens sometimes, and one sixteen-year-old boy said something to me that really made me sad: "I hate homemade chocolate chip cookies because they don't taste like Chips Ahoy." Heck, I had a huge sweet tooth as a kid, but given the choice between a Hostess cream cake and an eclair, even as a five-year-old I'd take an eclair.
I sometimes wonder if the whole 'forbidden food' aspect is why people keep turning to food for comfort--that and just the growing infantilization of all of our palates. In most cultures, children are acknowledged to have a sweeter palate than adults, but are gradually transitioned from eating 'food for babes' to a wider range of foods, while it seems more and more adults don't make the leap to the grown-up table at any point in their lives, and retain their kid/adolescent eating habits.
HeartofGlass at 8:22AM on 02/03/09
Two quick stories...my MIL was raised on a farm in Nebraska during the Depression. When I became her DIL, about 18+ years ago, the ONLY "seasoning she had in her kitchen was S&P!! She has come a long way, now has about 12 (and gives me credit for that!!). She said that seasonings were "luxuries" back then, especially after losing the farm.
My SIL is one of 9 kids. Her Mom cooked the same way as above...red sauce for pasta was catsup, thinned w/water, and S&P. When her kids were young, she would always tell them "don't eat that, you won't like it" or "don't eat that, it's nasty". Now, her 3 kids are adults, one is a fab cook, one still only eats chicken fingers, pizza and blue box mac & cheese, and the other is 50/50. BTW, she and my brother have a great marriage, only because she learned to cook, and she, also, has come a long way!!
Karencooks at 9:16AM on 02/03/09
I don't think it's hopeless and irreversible. I was never a Mickey D's kid, but I certainly used to like salty restaurant food and salty processed food, and I avoided vegetables like the plague. Actually, I still do like salty restaurant food and still sometimes eat salty processed food...though I no longer avoid veggies. Somewhere along the way, I decided to retry veggies. I salted them heavily (or ate them with gnarly processed cheese sauce), but got myself to eat them. Slowly, I salted them less and less (and ditched the Cheez Whiz) until my tastes adjusted, and now I eat and enjoy them without all the crap. The same thing happened with sweet. I ate less sugary food (excluding naturally sugary foods like fruit), and now a lot of food I liked before tastes too sweet to me now. I'll still plow through a box of sugar cereal given the chance though.
cycorider at 10:56AM on 02/03/09
To repair a horribly abused palate takes 3 things - Good Food, Patience and Time.
Crap food didn't start out tasting great - it was a burst of salt, fat and sugar. Eventually a palate would be coached by repeated abuse to believe this is "good."
Good food will need the same period of adjustment but won't pack the salt, fat and sugar jolt to make the transition less uncomfortable. Eventually, with time and repeated servings, the palate will come to "read" good, healthy, properly seasoned food as "correct." And delicious.
Every time I read about someone's parents who couldn't cook and some of the food they ate as kids, I thank God I was born to two excellent cooks. :D
therealchiffonade at 10:57AM on 02/03/09
@pav, bacon grease is real food. Margarine is not. Case closed.
Seriously, though, I have no problem with naturally-derived fats and sugars and I have no problem with salt in places that it does belong. Like on a pretzel. Or salting a preserved meat. Or in my own cooking.
I do have a problem with something that says "soup" on the label and finding out that it has more sugar than a Snickers bar and more salt than a bag of potato chips. (Okay, I don't know if there is a soup that horrible, but I'll bet some come close.) I'm tired of products that aren't what they seem to be. Soup should be soup, it shouldn't be a science experiment disguised as food.
If I'm going to eat something as a treat, I'm fine with it being high in sugar, fat, calories or salt, because it's a treat. Even with that, I'd prefer real fat, sugar and salt, not chemically derived, hydrogenated and artificially colored and flavored. What's wrong with whipped cream?
dbcurrie at 1:28PM on 02/03/09
mmmmmm..... whipped cream........
Pavlov at 2:00PM on 02/03/09
An apocalypse perhaps?
None of this crap pretend food was available when my grandparents and parents were growing up. My mother didn't buy it for her children, I didn't buy it for mine and they're not buying it for their children. That's not to say that they'll never taste something processed, have a can of soda, eat fast food, or try a shortcut, but they've grown up with good food and want the same for their own children. They've learned how to garden and can and freeze. For the majority who grew up thinking all this processed crap was real food, I have little hope. I do have to mention to @PumpkinBear that if her parents are elderly or taking certain medications, both can severely change the true taste of food. So can illness. I learned that myself recently and was absolutely shocked at the difference in perception of flavor and seasoning. I could understand completely why people suddenly refuse to eat. Nothing tastes even palatable. Can you imagine having someone like that cook for you - to their UNtaste? Not good.
PerkyMac at 2:18PM on 02/03/09
@Perky, your comment about not being able to taste correctly is one reason I end up eating boxed mac and cheese when I'm sick. So many things taste wrong, and if I try to cook, it just doesn't work. I can recall one time when I was trying to cook a vegetable soup while I had a raging cold, sinus issues, and who knows what. No matter what I did, that poor pot of soup just wasn't right. But I carried on, determined to make a decent dinner. At some point I figured it was as edible as it was going to get, and it was deemed dinner.
DH took one taste and said, "Have you tasted this?" He normally doesn't say things like that. Yes, of course I tasted it, but my tastebuds were all apparently using hallucinogenics, so nothing was as it seemed. It tasted a little bland to me, but otherwise fine. I suggested that maybe it needed salt.
A few days later, when I was feeling more human, I tasted the soup. And then I threw the rest away. It was horrible.
dbcurrie at 5:21PM on 02/03/09
When I was growing up, my mother cooked dinner every night and we rarely went out to eat from what I recall. My husband's family went out even less than mine did, which, to me, explains why he likes to eat out so much now.
My MIL was for the most part a single mother, even though she was married (deadbeat husband, you know the story). My husband remembers that she would make chicken and yellow rice and they would eat it for days. Nothing to dress it up, just chicken and rice. He has raved about some of the things she used to make so I have made each of them. According to him, my versions blow hers out of the water. I owe it all to seasoning and know-how.
I love trying new foods, but unfortunately in this God-forsaken corner of the world there is NO new food. My favorite restaurant is a Middle Eastern place in New Orleans. I would kill to have some of that right now. Here we have your ubiquitous steak houses, and AMericanized chinese and mexican.
DCraver at 12:26PM on 02/04/09
Funny thing taste is. No matter what you serve, someone won't like it. I develop hundreds of products a year for companies, and change almost every one to fit someones particular taste. Some of the most truly horrible food I have ever been subjected to is by Chefs and Foodies combining trendy flavors and themed meals into abortions on a plate (Sweet Vanilla Battered Veal Saltimboca gagged me). The forty chefs i was with raved, I went out to dinner after I left their meal. I have come to judge a persons ability to cook, by what they can do with things that are not considered in good taste, taking swill and turning not into gold, but at least something palateable. Too many foodies turn their foods into caricatures of good taste, too much hot pepper, Lets fit in a fusion flavor, lets add acai berry because it is good for you. Anyone can cook well if thy have the resources and training, show me someone who can takes canned foods and make people happy, or at least not sick, there is an artist.
As one who develops processed foods, I find it amusing when I hear raves over Alinea, performance food art that uses more additives than most processors would dare to use. I remember seeing these parlor tricks 30 years ago as a tool to sell alginates and gums. And those who sing his parises, damn my work because it is plebian and main stream.
If you are lucky to be in a major city and make enough money, you have access to the bounty of the world and its wealth of flavors. Let people eat what they enjoy, and don't think less of them because your palate has evolved in a different direction. Be thankfull you are not having to live on Chitterlings and Greens, but there are those who think that is good taste, go figure.
Meat guy at 3:13PM on 02/04/09
@ Meat Guy... I'm one of those people who eat Chitterlings and Greens... And I love them. Good food is just that, good simple ingredients prepared simply and with care. The whole "molecular gastronomy" thing in my opinion is awful... I don't want to guess what I'm eating, or be in awe of how beautiful it is... I WANNA EAT! At the same time I don't want chemicals or preservatives in my food. My grandparents didn't have them and they lived to a ripe old age. As far as canned foods are considered, with few exceptions I don't use them. Trends come and go but good honest food will always be in style!
Pavlov at 6:51AM on 02/05/09
the real truth in taste, is we do not taste things in the same way. Up until I was 20, i could never eat pork, it tasted bad to me most of the time. I never realized, until I worked for a meat company, that I was one of the select few afflicted with the ability to taste the sex hormones in meat. Boar meat, meat from heavy sows all tasted so bad i could vomit from the smell of it cooking alone. Beef from old dairy herds tasted milky, strange but too true. Someone tells me they had great boar meat or ham from boars, thank god you don't taste it like I do. The truth, is to appreciate taste, you need to try everything. Some will always have McPalates, because they can taste only in salty, sweet, sour and bitter. Others crave heat and smoke. I was trained at one point to taste analytically, identifying individual flavors and feelings as you eat, a distraction to good taste but a great key to understanding how people taste. The quality of the food, is not as important as the quality of the company, my best food memories are not the food, but the circumstances it was consumed under. If you base all of your life on other's expectations of what you should do, or eat, you miss a lot of life. Some truly bad meals are some of my best food memories.
Meat guy at 12:03PM on 02/05/09