Have any of you cooked with tobacco?
I have a sort of vague recollection of this being a brief fad in the culinary world, when I was in my teens, but can't remember much about it. I didn't pay attention.
Now, I'm seriously considering it as a flavouring for this year's chocolate truffles.
I thought a bit about what I might add to the mix that would resonate without adding an alien or pointless note, and rejected everything except espresso (I'm toying with the idea of ground cinnamon or cardamom). Then I wondered if I could think of at least one other flavour that would work as well... and thought of tobacco. I'm aware of the risks of nicotine poisoning, and making the flavour too strong. On the other hand, there IS chewing tobacco (I know that it's spit out, not swallowed, but some of it must be absorbed), and I'm thinking in terms of adding perhaps half a dozen shreds of tobacco to the mixture.
Have any of you experimented with tobacco as a flavouring ingredient, and if so, what were your experiences?
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39 Comments:
it gave me the munchies. then i had to have a suzie q, a bag of doritoes and a coke.
dearrie at 2:48PM on 11/08/08
It sounds seriously icky to me. Just a personal comment. But it also sounds like the sort of ingredient you'd want to disclose to people ahead of time. Ex-smokers might think that this could trigger their addiction all over again, and vehement non-smokers would probably want the chance to avoid it, just on prinicipal.
I'm thinking of this in terms of chocolates you're going to give away or serve somewhere. If they're just for you and for people you know very well, maybe a very small test batch would be appropriate, so you don't ruin a lot of good chocolate.
dbcurrie at 2:55PM on 11/08/08
Gotta say...no thanks. Not appealing in the very least. Tobacco, smoking and nicotine, in any way, shape or form is repulsive. It also stains your hands, teeth, bad breath and smokers cant taste worth a shit.
ChelleyD01 at 3:11PM on 11/08/08
Have not tried what you are considering, but when considered objectively as a flavorant, I would agree that there is potential in your concept. Certain notes in tobacco's flavor profile would probably combine exceptionally well with darker chocolates. As far as sourcing the tobacco, perhaps seek out a purveyor who specializes in pairing/serving higher end cigars and spirits. If you decide to proceed with this endeavor, please update.Where there's a will there's a way.
PommeDG at 3:41PM on 11/08/08
@dearrie.....i have the same problems when i make my "special" brownies....lmao
onepercent99 at 3:45PM on 11/08/08
When I was in Belgium about 4 years ago I did a lot of "chocolate surfing" in many of the wonderful shops there. The Belgians love their chocolate, and their chocolatiers are very inventive, creating all kinds of wild combos.... one popular at the time was tobacco.
I have to tell you that even as a heavy smoker at that time.... I thought it was awful. To me it jarred the tastebuds too much, stood out as an unpleasant "off" flavor. Just my personal taste....
If you're determined to try it I'd say do a small batch first before investing too much in time and ingredients. Pick a group of people with widely divergent tastes and have them do a taste test for you (make sure to include smokers and non smokers!)....
hmneilson at 4:35PM on 11/08/08
@onepercent99 is that Virginia, Turkish or Jamacian mon???
finsbigfan at 4:49PM on 11/08/08
Well, as for legal tobacco ;) did anyone see the Anthony Bourdain No Reservations when he went to The French Laundry? Thomas Keller had made, I think they were cones filled with sorbets, several different flavors. For Bourdain he made a tobacco one. A quick Google search brought up this: http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9E03E5DF1330F935A15750C0A9659C8B63
He just infused cigar tobacco like you would with tea leaves. I've done that with Earl Grey tea, and added it to chocolate cake. Pretty yum...
CityMinx at 5:40PM on 11/08/08
When I smoked, I dropped ashes into food on occasion. I can tell you that it did not ever enhance the taste of anything. I'd try orange, or raspberry, or even bacon if you want something really different, but edible. No tobacco or tobacco by-products for me, thanks.
PerkyMac at 5:45PM on 11/08/08
i think if you're really set on trying tobacco, an infusion, as suggested by cityminx, might be the way to go, rather than sticking it straight in the chocolate - even smokers try to avoid the tobacco actually in the mouth and as you pointed out, chewing tobacco is not meant to be swallowed.
billyburgwife at 7:14PM on 11/08/08
LOL Perky! And what has happened to the time-honored tradition of adding weed to your chocolate goods?
Seriously, though, it sounds nasty to me. I think I'd go with a chile infusion instead.... yum!
buffy at 7:48PM on 11/08/08
screw it.... get a pack of lucky's and chain smoke your way through it.... try delivering the flavor by exhaling the smoke onto the truffles..... *cough, Cough*
Pavlov at 10:17PM on 11/08/08
Ed Witt used tobacco in the braising medium for one of his dishes at the now shuttered Varietal. Frank Bruni liked it but overall panned the restaurant, Witt was fired, and they closed their doors only a few months later.
It's not such an outlandish idea, but it probably won't be easy to pull off. The infusion suggestion is a good one. However, you will probably have to make a few batches before you get it right, which does not sound like a very pleasant thing... But hey, more power to you, I wish you luck if you decide to try. Nothing ventured, nothing gained.
simon at 10:46PM on 11/08/08
If you make a tobacco "tea", by either throwing in cigarettes or even butts into a large container with water with a tight cap, it does have another useful purpose. Let it steep for a month or so and pour around the foundation of your house or building. Keeps insects outside where they belong. Could flavour chocolate, and keep away insects? Don't know about that application, but the other one works, and yes, it does stink. Phew.
PerkyMac at 10:56PM on 11/08/08
If you soak a cloth in that tobacco tea and apply it to a bruise, it can help it heal a lot faster than time would. Kinda like tobacco poultices for healing injured cattle.
sarahj at 11:36PM on 11/08/08
@sarahj ~ I will definitely try that.
And if you add ice and lemon to that tobacco tea, make sure you didn't use any butts. Sip it slowly after engaging in adult activities if you're out of your freakin' mind. ;-D
PerkyMac at 11:45PM on 11/08/08
Although American tobacco is the best in the world I would not ingest it. It can make you very ill. Tobacco is treated with all kinds of crap.
If you touch wet tobacco you can get something like benzene poisoning.
Nicotine is a drug. How about some heroin smoked chicken? All the gain and none of the pain.
JerzeeTomato at 12:10AM on 11/09/08
Ack! This wasn't meant to be controversial, I was just hoping that one of you had actually used tobacco in cooking, and would be able to share their experiences of how varying amounts work out in terms of flavour.
I am aware that tobacco may be treated with toxins, and that nicotine is poisonous;
the tobacco I have laying about is some organic stuff I picked up for someone, then forgot.
I have doubts that the half dozen (= 6) shreds I mentioned previously would prove toxic in a litre and a half of cream and chocolate.
I know that tobacco is addictive.
None of the people who would be eating these have ever smoked, so the issue of causing an ex-smoker to relapse is not present.
The idea would not be to use ash or cigarette butts, but unsmoked tobacco.
A tobacco (not tobacco smoke or ash) note is not unknown in food and alcohol (vanilla stright from the bean has a hint of this); my idea was to introduce an evanescent tobacco nuance to a sweet which happens to be peculiarly rich in flavour and texture. A tobacco note seemed likely to be more effective than other truffle flavouring I've come across (citrus, mint, basil, hazelnut, various alcoholics, etc.). I've tried both chillis and cayenne, and although they were okay, they didn't seem to me to have any good reason for being there (both were terrific in a fondant base flavoured with vanilla bean, however).
mongoose at 10:38AM on 11/09/08
Good GAH... I scanned the question and comments kinda fast this am and it wasn't till the cigarette butt tea did I ACTUALLY realize we were talking about TOBACCO and NOT TABASCO. I am so going back to bed...
bodaciousgirl at 10:52AM on 11/09/08
If the people you are cooking for have adventuous tastes, they might be interested. But I think the biggest problem is that you're fighting a hugely negative perception of the ingredient.
I like to think that I'm a fairly adventurous eater, but my first thought was that if you offered me a chocolate that was flavored with tobacco, I'd say no thanks, and be fighting back a gag reflex without even having tasted it.
If you gave it to me to taste, and then told me afterwards that there was tobacco in it, I think I'd be pissed that you didn't disclose that upfront. And then I'd be gagging.
dbcurrie at 1:46PM on 11/09/08
I smoke the S@#t not eat it. Boudain had a show where he had a chef make him something they made w/it?
pjracz10 at 1:51PM on 11/09/08
@dbcurrie: You have some points, and I do respect people's restrictions about food (e.g. I would never try to sneak meat into a dish for a vegetarian), but I'm not even thinking of making tobacco-flavoured truffles, as such; I want to introduce it as a background note (and my boyfriend's family doesn't regard tobacco as something dreadful, they simply don't smoke; never took up the habit). Sort of the way I often put a tiny amount of nutmeg into the rice I usually serve. It doesn't taste of nutmeg, there's just an elusive, somehow-familiar note.
I've tried saffron in truffles; I put in very little, and you didn't taste it while chewing, it emerged as a lingering after-scent. Not even a taste, really. It was okay, but it's presence felt clumsy in truffles. Boring and sort of forced.
I'd like to try something at the same level of intensity and presence, and tobacco seems like an option worth taking on.
I'm also lucky in that the people who would be eating these have a good deal of confidence in my cooking (and I'm not intending to let them down :))
I keep hoping someone who's blazed this trail before me will see this ...
mongoose at 3:10PM on 11/09/08
@mongoose, good luck, i don't think you're crazy for wanting to try it - i feel like lots of wines have tobacco notes in them, so it isn't such a huge leap to try to introduce that to chocolate.
billyburgwife at 5:45PM on 11/09/08
@mongoose: A tobacco-clove flavored chocolate truffle might be absolutely amazing. I'd certainly try that. Have you tried this combination yet?
I've never cooked with tobacco, but this 2001 NY Times article by Melissa Clark may be helpful and even encouraging. Good luck!
Susquehanna at 6:56PM on 11/09/08
@mongoose: Ahem. I meant to inquire if you've used cloves to flavor any of your truffles.
From my experience, cloves will not add an "alien" or "pointless" aspect to tobacco; both are lovely and spicy. Years ago, I'd occasionally enjoy a Djarum Special or two.
Susquehanna at 7:21PM on 11/09/08
@billyburgwife: Wines definitely have tobacco notes. Spicy red zinfandels, in particular. And natural tobacco -- I used to like American Spirit natural tobacco products -- gives off an essence of leather. It made me feel earthy and rugged.
Susquehanna at 7:36PM on 11/09/08
@Susquehanna: Thanks for that link :) :) :)
I do realize that the descriptions in the article don't come directly from the chefs themselves, so should be regarded with caution, but they do indicate that my pinch of tobacco shreds in the volume of truffle I'm planning to use should be fine.
Either last year or the year before I made truffles with various spices, including clove. My ambivalence towards clove is that even at tiny amounts, it tends to really take over, and I definitely want chocolate to be in the foreground. I could make a larger batch, of course, and increase the dilution factor. I'd just have to be REALLY firm about leaving any truffles that weren't eaten with my boyfriend's parents, or I know I'd end up eating the lot ;)
mongoose at 2:46AM on 11/10/08
I don't think that sounds appetizing at all...and if you were to try it, I would definitely warn your tasters about the ingredient. I know for some people (myself included) eating or ingesting a tobacco product would violate their religious beliefs.
juliebugsmama at 10:55AM on 11/10/08
@juliebugs - Dito. Even if tobacco wasn't against my religious principles, it just sounds gross. I could imagine myself and many others being put off by being unsuspectingly fed tobacco in chocolate.
kazoinker at 2:43PM on 11/10/08
Check with a tobacconist. I have a friend who rolls his own and uses chemical free tobacco.
The infusion idea has some merit. Maybe you could infuse the cream???
I dont smoke but I would try a one. Then again - I'm wierd.
Maureen
MaureenCDRyan at 3:43PM on 11/10/08
AAARGH... I feel like most people aren't even reading what I wrote :(
I'm not considering stuffing chocolates with masses of wet tobacco, but steeping about six (this many: * * * * * *) shreds of organic tobacco (not ashes, not cigarette butts) in half a litre of cream, say, overnight in the refrigerator, removing them, then combining this with a litre of chocolate. Truffles.
I am aware of the issues of toxicity, addiction, religious restrictions, the unpleasant flavour of cigarette ashes/butts, etc.
I respect people's restrictions with regard to tobacco, alcohol, meat, non-organically produced foods, the entire gamut of allergens and tabu foods!
All I wanted to know was A) had any SE posters used tobacco in cooking? and B) if someone had worked with tobacco, how had it worked out?
mongoose at 6:57PM on 11/10/08
Other cultures have been using whole tobacco leaves for wrapping and cooking food, same as banana leaves, for centuries. I have been trying to locate some fresh whole leaves with no success. Any suggestions? I will contact a tobacconist for the dried version (organic) as recommended by another post, but I also am looking for Appalachian grown. I am a chef and plan on infusing some wild game. There are many cigar varieties that have additional natural flavorings such as vanilla that would enhance your chocolates.
provencemkt at 6:10PM on 11/28/08
@provencemkt: If you are purchasing leaves for a restaurant, I did find this page of exporters: http://dir.indiamart.com/impcat/tobacco-leaves.html
I don't know of any brick and mortar shops that sell whole, food-safe (i.e. without pesticides or other additives that may be present in tobacco that has been prepared for smoking), but you can buy seeds and grow it yourself: Between the wars, many Danes grew tobacco in their backyards, so if it can be done here, with short, cool summers, it can be done in the US. You can buy seeds online if you google "tobacco seeds" (one I found is http://www.organicaseedco.com/tobaccoseeds.html).
mongoose at 6:40PM on 11/28/08
@mongoose: Thank you, yes, I am looking for tobacco for the restaurant. The sites you provided are very helpful... I'll aim for next spring for the "grow your own" or at least for USA grown.
Have you tried your recipe yet?
provencemkt at 7:04PM on 11/28/08
@provencemkt: I haven't made these yet, but I think I'll soon try a test batch, because I'm really curious as to how they'll turn out.
And if any of those sites are useful, I'm glad to have helped out :)
mongoose at 1:53PM on 11/29/08
@mongoose: Finally prepared my rabbit loins with tobacco and they turned out great. Flavor was suble and if you didn't know what the ingredient was you would not guess it to be tobacco. Kind of a "je ne sais pas"??? I used American Spirit - US grown/organic, just a few threads...
provencemkt at 4:24PM on 01/13/09
That sounds really good and I'm glad to hear it turned out well; did you use the tobacco as a marinade ingredient, or during the cooking?
I used American Spirit for my truffles, too. I put the tobacco shreds in a tea ball, and steeped it in the cream as I heated it, then just proceeded as usual. If you did not know to look for it, the tobacco note was easily missed; it essentially amplified a similar note already present in the chocolate I used.
mongoose at 5:00AM on 01/14/09
@mongoose: I actually soaked the tobacco and then wrung it out in paper towels. I put the threads directly in the vacuum bag with the rabbit, added salt and pepper, a bit of oil, and then immersed the bag in a constant temperature water bath (sous-vide). The rabbit I used was very young so really didn't need a marinade. Very easy. Your idea using the tea ball is a good one...
provencemkt at 12:30PM on 01/14/09
I've always enjoyed the sweet smell you get in a cigar/tobacco room. Just earlier today I was thinking that it seemed as though I ought to be able to add those notes to a sweet. I believe I saw an Iron Chef episode wherein one or both of the chefs used tobacco, I think one was an ice cream (with vanilla I believe). I went out to get a cigar, and exploring my collection of flavorings, sniffing them next to the cigar, it seems as though it would work well. Particularly pleasant were vanilla, cinnamon, chocolate, and cumin. So tonight, I am going to try steeping some tobacco bits in some heavy cream with a vanilla bean, which will be used to make a salted sweet caramel which will be drizzled atop some dark chocolate brownies.
Needless to say, I bet a truffle would be very nice!
popkin at 7:51PM on 11/13/09